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Bug 83653 - HIG should specify that stop and reload go in the view menu not go menu
HIG should specify that stop and reload go in the view menu not go menu
Status: RESOLVED FIXED
Product: gnome-devel-docs
Classification: Applications
Component: hig
unspecified
Other Linux
: Normal normal
: ---
Assigned To: HIG Maintainers
HIG Maintainers
Depends on:
Blocks: 83691
 
 
Reported: 2002-05-31 05:19 UTC by Dave Bordoley [Not Reading Bug Mail]
Modified: 2020-12-04 18:20 UTC
See Also:
GNOME target: ---
GNOME version: 2.0



Description Dave Bordoley [Not Reading Bug Mail] 2002-05-31 05:19:04 UTC
go => stop and go => reload make no sense. Items in the go menu should be
places or directions 

for example where do you want to go?
go => forward, go => home

in contrast stop and reload act on the current view. eg. Reload the current
view, stop loading the current view.

Currently nautilus puts reload in the view menu, and i have recommended to
galeon that they add both stop and reload to their view menu.
Comment 1 Christian Rose 2002-05-31 18:55:26 UTC
I don't think so. "View Stop" and "View Reload" makes even less sense
than "Go Stop" and "Go Reload".
The "View" in menus is the *verb* "view", not the noun "view". Menu
items should be actions, not nouns.

The verb and the noun may be the same word in English so it's not
apparent but as soon you translate it, these problems become very
apparent. "How do I view stop?" "View reload? I don't want to watch
reloads!"
Comment 2 Calum Benson 2002-05-31 19:12:33 UTC
Actually, the View in the menu *is* supposed to be a noun-- it
contains items that change your View of the application data.  As you
say, though, it's quite ambiguous-- bad choice by Xerox PARC (or
whoever it was who first used it) :/

As such, I think "Reload View" does make more sense than "Go Reload"
(or "Reload Go"), but neither "Stop View" nor "Stop Go" really make
all that much sense at all :/  But I think they should go together
wherever they end up.
Comment 3 Christian Rose 2002-05-31 19:19:15 UTC
> Actually, the View in the menu *is* supposed to be a noun

In that case, there are a lot of translations to fix. In a lot of
operating systems.

Better is to leave the view menu to actions that only affect the
presentation of the document, and leave navigational items out of it.
Comment 4 Calum Benson 2002-05-31 19:24:15 UTC
Quite agree, that's supposed to be the case whether you regard "View"
as a noun or a verb anyway.  However, it's extremely debatable whether
"Stop" or "Reload" are navigational or not, as they don't take you
anywhere.  You stay exactly where you are.  At most, all that changes
is what you see at your current location... your view, in other words
:)
Comment 5 Christian Rose 2002-05-31 19:34:42 UTC
Well, they surely aren't presentational. They don't in themselves
affect how documents are presented. On the other hand I'd argue that
they are navigational since they control how you go from one document
to the other, or even to the same document.

Nevertheless, since moving these to "view" causes problems in
localized versions on several platforms, I don't think this should be
recommended at all.
Comment 6 Dave Bordoley [Not Reading Bug Mail] 2002-06-02 14:12:07 UTC
This is interesting since no one ever complained about the fact that
reload is in the view menu in nautilus.

I think putting reload and stop in the go menu makes no sense at all.
Items in the go menu are places where you go, you don't go stop. In
fact go and stop totally contradict each other. They complete
contradict each other.

You do reload the current view, the same way you zoom in on the
current view. Stop is actually stop loading the thing i'm trying to view.

Comment 7 Dave Bordoley [Not Reading Bug Mail] 2002-06-03 18:20:16 UTC
Just wanted to note that mozilla puts both stop and reload in the view
menu, so there is prior precedent for this.
Comment 8 Christian Rose 2002-06-03 18:26:04 UTC
So does Internet Explorer, so well, I give up. ;)
Comment 9 Dave Bordoley [Not Reading Bug Mail] 2002-06-03 18:45:25 UTC
The question now is where in the view menu should they go. For now in
galeon i put stop and reload as the first two menu items in view, but
i only did so since nautilus does this as well with reload. Should
they be at the top or moved farther down the list???
Comment 10 Christian Rose 2002-06-03 19:17:05 UTC
Internet Explorer puts them grouped somewhere near the middle, with 
menu seperators around them. In any case, I think the seperators is a 
good idea, so that they can visually be grouped, since they are 
obviously a bit different than the rest of the View menu items.
Comment 11 Dave Bordoley [Not Reading Bug Mail] 2002-06-03 19:21:35 UTC
Right now they are at the top, and there is a seperator between them
and  toolbar menu items. Suggestions..., I actually don't mind them
being at the top. Since they are more likely to be used than other
options..but i'm really open on this one.
Comment 12 Calum Benson 2002-06-07 17:39:22 UTC
I forget what else is on the menu and I can't check right now, so this
isn't a definitive answer, but... I would actually be quite surprised
if 'Reload' and especially 'Stop' were often accessed from the menu at
all.  Most people use the toolbar or keyboard shortcuts for these, in
which case IE's policy of grouping them near the middle of the menu is
probably fairly reasonable.
Comment 13 Dave Bordoley [Not Reading Bug Mail] 2002-06-07 17:44:41 UTC
I willing to move them for galeon to the middle, i just would like a
definitive answer first as to where they should be grouped though so
that i don't have to keep  on changing it. I will also do thi s for
nautilus post 2.0
Comment 14 Dave Bordoley [Not Reading Bug Mail] 2002-09-25 02:16:14 UTC
fixed