Created attachment 301320 [details]
Titlebar with additional border in Firefox

I think there's some problem with your screeshot - it is only 1920 pixels wide for both desktops and looks like it might be downscaled. (For other people looking at this bug the thread linked to does have useful screenshots.)

I just found out that this has actually nothing to do with "native" vs "non-native". GNOME terminal for instance looks "weird", too. It might actually be the additional menu that triggers this.

(In reply to Karol Babioch from comment #3)
> I just found out that this has actually nothing to do with "native" vs
> "non-native". GNOME terminal for instance looks "weird", too. It might
> actually be the additional menu that triggers this.

The difference is between "client side" and "server side" decorations - whether they are being drawn by the toolkit (GTK+) or the window manager (GNOME Shell)

The bottom border in the titlebar is part of the GTK+ theme and consistent with client-side decorations. Those generally don't use menubars though, so the impression is different - it might make sense to style server-side decorations differently there, but that's up for the designers to decide.

Moving to GTK+ which provides the default theme.

This is a matter of taste issue, to me it's more consistent to have csd and ssd windows decoration sharing the same look, also the "open" titlebar created quite a bit of problems themewise, sorry guys I don't really feel like going back to what we used to have.
Regarding the terminal it looks ok to me with the new style menubar (the terminal has style problems which can't be solved by the theme tho, like a missing frame around the vte window... but this is another story), gtk+2 apps looks pretty bad since the old menubar design and old notebook design, I'm working on fixing gtk+2 Adwaita (well at least I'm trying to, my brain discarded all the old theming stuff infos unfortunatelly) .

sounds like a wontfix

this "bug" is fixed with the css changes here:

https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?pid=1519016#p1519016

gtk2 and qt apps (chrome, firefox, vlc ecc) are perfect now, and also gnome-terminal looks good again

the new look is really good for gnome apps (apart gnome-terminal), but gtk2 and qt apps look really ugly, please reconsider you decision for compatibility with non gnome 3 apps, 

thanks Nicola

I would appreciate an reconsideration also, especially since there seems to be a "fix" available. Not familiar with GNOME theming, so I can't add much value from a technical standpoint, but from a user's standpoint it looks really bad now.

I'm cheeky enough to re-open this bug, if you *really* don't want to fix it, just close it down again ;). But I definitely want a developer to take a look at the proposed fix.

Lapo is the Adwaita designer and developer.

Emmanuele,

Lapo probably use only gnome 3 apps or don't consider theme compatibility with non gnome 3 apps a priority. For most users this is a regression from 3.14. We'll use the fix above hoping that you reconsider your choice,

thanks anyway

(In reply to Nicola from comment #12)
> Lapo probably use only gnome 3 apps or don't consider theme compatibility
> with non gnome 3 apps a priority.

Of course, no designer ever uses apps like GIMP or Inkscape ;-)

This is a highly subjective matter, and it's perfectly fine for you to prefer the old style. Just as it was fine for users to dislike the seamless titlebars that were used before, which happens to be an issue "fixed" by the new theme.

(In reply to Florian Müllner from comment #13)
> Just as it was fine for users to dislike the seamless
> titlebars that were used before, which happens to be an issue "fixed" by the
> new theme.

Was there a bug report for that?

(In reply to Florian Müllner from comment #13)
> This is a highly subjective matter,

Yes, of course, and you never will be able to make everyone happy at the same time. I will live with the new design, although I still think it looks silly.

Nevertheless I would like you guys to keep an open mind about issues like this. Simply closing it down with "WONTFIX" seems wrong to me, because similar complaints will then be closed down with a reference to this report.

I'm not familiar with your internal processes, but maybe a poll or some sort of evaluation would be the right thing to do in the future. Up until now I was more than happy with the changes that each GNOME 3 release introduced, but this particular one I don't like. It seems I'm not alone with this opinion, so let's just wait for GNOME 3.16 to hit the mainstream distributions ;). Probably there will be much of an outcry then, which might make you reconsider your decision ;).

The "open" titlebar was basically a visual trick to make the titlebar and menubar looking like a single entity hence less dated, unfortunately it's not possible by the theme to add that "missing line" where needed (being after the menubar or the titlebar) in a general working way, since apps use a wildly varying widget structure, hence it required a lot of app by app tweaks, clearly this didn't scale making things pretty unmaintainable.
So my decision to get rid of that trick, also since most core apps (apart the ones with pretty difficult maintainers to interact with) sport csd titlebars (we call those headerbars), the different server side decorated windows were an unneded inconsistency.

I know the gtk+2 apps (I have at least an inkscape instance open all the time) looks pretty bad with it, the theme hasn't been updated, since there's nobody looking after it atm, I'm working on it btw, so hopefully things will be better in the near future.

Karol, believe me I try to keep my mind as open as I can, but trying to please everybody with taste related stuff is really not possible.

(In reply to Lapo Calamandrei from comment #16)
> The "open" titlebar was basically a visual trick [...]

Thanks for your detailed explanation.

> I know the gtk+2 apps (I have at least an inkscape instance open all the
> time) looks pretty bad with it,

Ok, since you're acknowledging it I'm positive that things will get better in the future ;). 

> Karol, believe me I try to keep my mind as open as I can, but trying to
> please everybody with taste related stuff is really not possible.


Yes, and I understand the misery you're in. As already said I'm all for innovation and trying out new things, but in this particular case it feels like a "regression" to me.

Thanks again for your reply!

(In reply to Karol Babioch from comment #17)
> (In reply to Lapo Calamandrei from comment #16)
> > The "open" titlebar was basically a visual trick [...]
> 
> Thanks for your detailed explanation.
> 
> > I know the gtk+2 apps (I have at least an inkscape instance open all the
> > time) looks pretty bad with it,
> 
> Ok, since you're acknowledging it I'm positive that things will get better
> in the future ;). 

a far future ... still no changes in gnome 3.22

> 
> > Karol, believe me I try to keep my mind as open as I can, but trying to
> > please everybody with taste related stuff is really not possible.
> 
> 
> Yes, and I understand the misery you're in. As already said I'm all for
> innovation and trying out new things, but in this particular case it feels
> like a "regression" to me.
> 
> Thanks again for your reply!

Nicola, this bug is closed, if you have something interesting to add please reopen or open a new one, the gtk+2 look drastically improved in 3.20+ since Juraj updated the adwaita gtk+2 theme to match the gtk3 look better, but this is unrelated the bottom border on the headerbar which I don't really feel like changing back as already expressed.

(In reply to Lapo Calamandrei from comment #19)
> Nicola, this bug is closed, if you have something interesting to add please
> reopen or open a new one, the gtk+2 look drastically improved in 3.20+ since
> Juraj updated the adwaita gtk+2 theme to match the gtk3 look better, but
> this is unrelated the bottom border on the headerbar which I don't really
> feel like changing back as already expressed.

sorry for the comment, no need to open a new bug since you don't really feel like changing back as already expressed and you know the gtk+2 apps looks pretty bad

for reference this is my actual gtk.css

window.ssd headerbar.titlebar {                                                 
  border: none;
  background-image: linear-gradient(to bottom,
  shade(@theme_bg_color, 1.05),
  shade(@theme_bg_color, 0.99));
  box-shadow: inset 0 1px shade(@theme_bg_color, 1.4);
}