GNOME Bugzilla – Bug 387546
Better status icons
Last modified: 2011-01-31 12:00:05 UTC
The current status icons (online, offline and away) are "efficient" (clear visual meaning) but seem old fashioned. What about getting new Tangofied icons?
Yes please, that would be very nice. If you (or anyone else) want to help out poking the Tango designers it would help speed up the process.
CC'ing Luca Ferretti who has been helping us a lot in Epiphany. :)
Created attachment 79443 [details] tangofied status icons Just changed the palette and stuff like that and made them slightly bigger. Are you happy with only 16x16 or should I create some 22x22 as well?
Very nice. I have some comments: - The green circle is really nice and cheerful - The red triangle is nice, perhaps it could be slightly lighter? - The clock on the red triangle would be better if it wasn't white, maybe cream or grey, or is this just me? Better yet, we don't use the colour blue for anything, so what do people think about changing the Extended Away icon to a blue clock or something? - The 'x' inside the offline icon should really be black or a dark grey IMO because it is hard to see what is in the middle of the square when it is smaller. - I am not sure about them being bigger yet, I need to use them some more to decide really. I don't think I like them bigger, they look ok in the roster, but in the chat windows, they look like they are the wrong size. I think we should stick to the same size icons that we already have (I can't remember if that is 16² or 22²). Also, do these colours that are used comply with the GNOME HIG palette recommendations?
Martyn, the colors are tangoified, which is what all icons are moved to in gnome. I think the triangle looks better bigger but the green blob is a bit too big. Regarding the 'x' in the offline icon, I don't agree that it should be darker since that would make it look like a close button imo.
Richard, I was just making sure this won't be a problem for colour blind users :) and that it is consistent with other Tango colours. About the 'x', why have it at all then? If I am honest it irritates be having to look closely at what is in the square without it being immediately obvious. But I am nit picking now :) (and I agree about your comment that it might look like the 'close' button). Andreas, any chance you could do the gnome-pending.png too? It is there for contacts which you are waiting for subscription from.
Created attachment 79457 [details] second try Martyn: Hope you like these better! Yes, these comply with the tango style guidelines that we use for gnome-icon-theme and everywhere else in GNOME.
Created attachment 79458 [details] same as second try but no X
Extended away means "more away than away" :) After 5 minutes, you go away, then after 30 minutes you go extended away. So the extended away icon should look like the away one but some small difference, not it looks like the available one instead.
Honestly I've a doubt about this implementation, while I think it's not so bad. Let's me explain. The status icon is always visible in notification area, showing, of course the current status of your connection (available, busy, away, offline). To simply recognize the current status we can use different colors (green, yellow, red, gray) But Gossip is currently also using different shapes (dot, triangle, square): is this good or bad? When the status changes, the icon changes both color and shape: some users could think that this is a new icon from a different application. IMHO we need a "basic" shape (while I don't have any good idea for it) to identify the application and colors to identify current status.
Andreas, I like the new blue clock and the new offline icon, very nice. We just need to resolve the away/extended away issue here: Richard, I tend to agree, but does it really matter if they are so different? Luca, there is a good reason for having different shapes, it means if you are colour blind you are not completely helpless to understand the states. That is the reason for it IIRC.
Created attachment 79475 [details] Presence icons from a Nokia mobile phone Backing up stuff in my sister's Nokia mobile, I found those icons. I don't know where are used, but are named Presence-NUM.gif Here is a basic shape (the door) and color variation to identify current status (from top to left, IMHO, available, busy, away, offline). Of course the door metaphor could be not so good: we are yet using it as for exit and logout in GNOME, but the idea could be good.
(In reply to comment #11) > Richard, I tend to agree, but does it really matter if they are so different? There is just no logic at all in having the two away states look that much different, and even worse have one of them look like the available state.
> There is just no logic at all in having the two away states look that much > different, and even worse have one of them look like the available state. You are right as always :) > Of course the door metaphor could be not so good: we are yet using it as for > exit and logout in GNOME, but the idea could be good. Sorry Luca, I don't think the door idea will work :/ > same as second try but no X Thanks Andreas, they look quite good now. For extended away, I did play tonight by having a blue triangle with a clock in the middle, it looks OK but I think the clock over the triangle you originally had works better. I played with that too. The clock needs to be a tad smaller (½ a pixel or so), the white center should really be a yellow or light cream colour, that looks nicer IMO, and the clock arms should be darker + be round edged. - I can send you the version I created if you want. While we are here, can we take a quick look at some of the others? - gossip-typing.png - gossip-pending.png - gossip-group-message.png - gossip-message.png Especially the message icons, we use those all the time :)
And as an extra would be great to have protocols icons (msn,jabber,irc,...) for the TELEPATHY branch
Xavier, do you mean for dialogs (add contact, add account etc)? Or for the roster?
Created attachment 79617 [details] Another approach to status icons These are the ones we use in Landell (http://tapioca-voip.sourceforge.net/wiki/index.php/Landell). Heavily inspirated by google talk. Looks like this in that UI: http://tapioca-voip.sourceforge.net/wiki/images/d/d2/Landell-presence.png
Andreas, I personally don't like those icons that much. Micke, I assume just protocol icons, I don't think we will be using separate icons for different protocols will we?
At least protocol icons, but would be great to have a nice way to tell the user from which protocol a contact comes from. Something like gaim: compose the status icon in the lower right of a protocol icon in the roster... It's just an idea that should be discussed, I think.
Martyn: All right, just giving you more stuff to choose from. :) Xavier: Having that info in the rooster does mean a more noisy interface, and I'm not really sure what the user would do with that information.
I think it makes sense to use protocol icons in dialogs (add contact, add account etc) and also if we add "virtual contacts" and have a way to show which of a real persons acccounts are connected so you can choose which protocol to use.
I've been running for a while now with the version in http://bugzilla.gnome.org/attachment.cgi?id=79458 and I like the colors, they look fresh and "tango-y". I don't think the extended away icons works though, for the reasons I listed above, and also because it looks a lot like the current "pending contact" icon we are (ab)using (maybe we need to change that one too). How about still overlaying a clock on top of the normal away icone, but making the clock a bit larger? That could make it easier to make it clear and look good, while maintaining the basic shape that we use for away. I wonder if we should use the blue one but with a question mark or something like that for pending/unknown/whatever contacts...
Created attachment 80014 [details] Tangoified protocol icons Andreas mentioned on the Tango-artists list that some IM protocols' icons are needed here. As we(Vinicius Depizzol and I) created these icons for Landel and Gajim applications, and as they are GPL, I am attaching a package with them. The package includes sizes of 16x16, 22x22, 32x32 and 48x48 for: aim, ekiga, gadu-gadu, gizmo, google-talk, icq, irc, jabber, msn, tlen and yahoo. Changes are possible when required.
Josef, thanks they look great. All we need now is tango icons for: - gossip-typing.png - gossip-pending.png - gossip-group-message.png - gossip-message.png Anyone up for it?
Martyn: Grabbing these
Andreas, forgive me, but what does that mean :) you are doing them?
Uh, yes :)
Created attachment 80018 [details] New Extended Away Images This is my version of the extended away PNG and SVG. It simply moves the clock more centrally and makes the clock background yellow so it is less stark to look at.
Created attachment 80028 [details] message-new in 22x22 If you're happy with this I'll go along and create the other sizes as well.
It looks very nice imo. I wonder how it will work at 16x16?
Created attachment 80034 [details] message-new in 22x22 and 16x16 as well Richard: Something along the lines of this.
Created attachment 80035 [details] message-new in 22x22 and 16x16 as well Richard: Something along the lines of this.
Nice work Andreas, I have tried this, and it isn't obvious what the star is without looking, perhaps it would look better with just some "..." inside the bubble, what do you think?
It looks good to me, and the star idiom is pretty common afaik for all of gnome.
Yea, ignore me, I have changed my mind :)
Ah, beautiful Andreas!
Created attachment 80389 [details] process-typing animation in 22x22 Using a frame-type animation like nautilus.
Created attachment 80390 [details] preview of process-typing in 300 m/s
Created attachment 80392 [details] group-chat in 22x22
Andreas, hi, very nice work. I especially like the group chat image. I am not sure about the typing image yet - do we need some sort of hand in the image to make it more obvious? What do others think?
The group chat icon is nice, but a bit visually equal to the "new message" one, so it kind of looks like you have new messages in the group chats all the time. Maybe there is a way to make it look a bit more different (the icons used for normal (non-group) chats are the status icons so it might make sense to try and make it look a bit more like those). It's pretty cool with an animated icon for the typing one :) Since we have a tooltip explaining that the user is typing, I think it's fine (plus displaying body parts should be avoided in icons iirc (offensive in some parts of the world).
Created attachment 80704 [details] group-chat Agree about the bubbles, here is another approach.
Nice, they are a little too dark IMO, any chance they could be a little lighter?
Created attachment 80715 [details] lighter version a little bit lighter, and the contrast between the dudes are a litte bit bigger.
Nice, how does it look in 16x16? Could get a little unclear, I guess.
Created attachment 80721 [details] in 16x16 and 22x22 16x16 is quite big ;)
Created attachment 80866 [details] status-pending in 22x22
Cool, we could use this for real unknown contacts and maybe use the old (or a new) version of pending for pending contacts (those who have requested to be on the list but aren't yet).
so status-pending and status-unknown then?
I think that might work well, yes.
Created attachment 81816 [details] process-typing in 16x16 No animation yet I'm afraid, but Richard asked me to get at least a still image done before the release.
Thanks!
The new process-typing icon is a bit unclear, looks more like building blocks than keys in a keyboard to me. Further more it's very discrete and almost unnoticeable next to the other icons. In my opinion the typing icon and the new message should be easier to spot when just looking over the roster. With the old icons they were and also it was more obvious that there was a "white" row since the other icons were darker as well. Now all the icons are bright and it's harder to spot the white icons. We should also add support for "icon themes" as I for one prefer the old icons to the new ones.
I agree that the typing one is too subtle, especially in the contact list. To summarize the comments from above, and adding my own comments after using those for a bit now: * "typing" is a bit subtle, the whole point of it is to get the attention of the user so it needs to be more clear from the background and the other icons * "extended away", the clock looks a bit too bright, I agree with Martyn on that. * "group chat", it's a bit dark, especially compared to the other ones. Maybe having a different (or more different if that's already the case) shade on the the guys could help as well? Committing the icons at least got some more comments and testing, that's good. The question now is, should we perhaps revert to the old ones and add the new ones as a Tango theme when we have theme support (and tweaked them some more)? That might be the best way I guess.
One more comment after comparing with the old ones, the available icon really is a very bright green shade, almost to the point where it is distracting. This is a lot more clear when using the icons in gossip compared to just looking at them in an image viewer.
I have updated the extended-away icon to a crappy version I did - actually, I think I have a better version somewhere but anyway, it is not as bright which is good for me. My comments though are: * "typing" is weird, it is not obvious enough IMO. Either we need some letters on those keys OR we need a hand of illustrating typing. * "extended away" is really difficult because we have 2 things in there, the other state (the triangle) and a clock and there are only so many pixels :) After speaking to Richard, perhaps we need a light grey colour here for the clock face, like the offline grey? * "group chat" is quite nice when I see it in the notebook with all my other chats, but I agree it is a little too dark. Richard and I spoke further on this and think that perhaps a lighter grey and ANOTHER shade of grey for the other contact behind might work better. * "pending" needs finishing. Didn't we have a question mark for this? Is there some reason why we didn't commit this Richard? I don't think we need a different icon for people we have added but who haven't accepted AND people that have requested to be added that WE haven't accepted - they should both have a "?" That reminds me - we need to change the way Gossip handles pending contacts, I think they should always be shown and exempt of the offline rules in the roster since it is easy to loose them. There is a bug about this somewhere.
(In reply to comment #56) > * "pending" needs finishing. Didn't we have a question mark for this? Is there > some reason why we didn't commit this Richard? I don't think we need a > different icon for people we have added but who haven't accepted AND people > that have requested to be added that WE haven't accepted - they should both > have a "?" That reminds me - we need to change the way Gossip handles pending > contacts, I think they should always be shown and exempt of the offline rules > in the roster since it is easy to loose them. There is a bug about this > somewhere. The reason is that it's only available in 22x22 so far.
Mikael: with http://live.gnome.org/ThemableAppIcons, all you would need to do is to create a icon-theme, name it Mikaels-icons, have it inherit gnome-icon-theme and put it in ./icons, so I would strongly advice putting any kind of theming functionality as a preference in Gossip itself as I must say it's rather horrible to have to set something up 20 times in different apps on a fresh install (grrr...I dare you, Firefox and Thunderbird!) ;) I found the animation helped a lot in process-typing, and I'm sorry that I don't have any time animating the 16x16 version before the release. A problem with using hands in the icons is that the old hand looked like it gave me the finger and hands/gestures in interfaces are a big no-no with regards to 110n. I could give it a shot though, but it would have to wait to next week I'm afraid. Regarding the other icons, I agree with your points and I'll get my hands dirty with them sometime early next week.
Andreas, I will not release until we are happy with the icons :) So I doubt it will be this weekend. Also, could you resize the pending icon to be the same size as the others and then we can commit that?
Oh, ok. In that case, give me a couple of days and I'll fix them up.
i hope i don't piss anyone off by asking this, but is there a tango style application icon for gossip aswell?
Björn, no of course not :) Andreas, is there any chance we could have a message icon and a new message icon - the reason for this is that the chat window would look nice if we have a regular icon for normal messages when none are waiting to read and another when we have one or more messages waiting to read.
Björn, I don't think there is a new application icon in the working but I would welcome an update to that as well.
Björn: in time. :)
Created attachment 82137 [details] message in 16x16 and 22x22 Martyn: not sure what you mean exactly, but here they are. (Hope the interface just don't get too noisy now.)
Andreas, no that looks perfect ;) thank you.
Created attachment 82179 [details] tango application icon
björn: no sources (xcf/svg) for the small sizes?
Created attachment 82189 [details] tango application icon sorry. here's the full set including all svg files.
Created attachment 82197 [details] app icon again... minor fixes sorry for the noise :/ won't happen again.
Comment on attachment 82197 [details] app icon again... minor fixes sorry, i forgot to obsolete the previous 2 :(
These icons seem great, and I caught them in SVN for a few days but now they've disappeared back to the old ones again... what happened? :E
I reverted it because there are still issues, as you can see from the comments above.
(In reply to comment #58) > Mikael: with http://live.gnome.org/ThemableAppIcons, all you would need to do > is to create a icon-theme, name it Mikaels-icons, have it inherit > gnome-icon-theme and put it in ./icons, so I would strongly advice putting any > kind of theming functionality as a preference in Gossip itself as I must say > it's rather horrible to have to set something up 20 times in different apps on > a fresh install (grrr...I dare you, Firefox and Thunderbird!) ;) Unfortunately it's not as easy as that. It can be done once we depend on a newer GNOME (i.e. a newer icon-theme spec). The current one would have to lump all icons together in one directory, basically, at least from what I can see (if we are not to put a lot of symlinks in there to support both versions). > I found the animation helped a lot in process-typing, and I'm sorry that I > don't have any time animating the 16x16 version before the release. A problem > with using hands in the icons is that the old hand looked like it gave me the > finger and hands/gestures in interfaces are a big no-no with regards to 110n. I > could give it a shot though, but it would have to wait to next week I'm afraid. While the animation was pretty nifty, it's far from "plug and play" to put an animation in there, especially in the treeview and window titlebar icon. So I don't think that is an option after all. It feels like all I do is nag about your nice icons, sorry about that. But the old ones were pretty well thought out and has worked nicely so I don't want to have something that works less good just for an updated look...
Created attachment 82276 [details] process-typing (with hand) How do you feel about this?
To use a swedish expression: "Pekfingersvalsen" :) Somewhat more series it somewhat looks like someone pointing at a keyboard rather than typing. True enough that many people look like that when typing but I wouldn't use it as the correct way of typing. How about we look at some icon including "..." or similar rather than a keyboard?
"Pekfingertangon" rather ;)
Haha!
Why not just have a "pekfinger" :) with no keyboard? I think having a keyboard which is quite a detailed piece of kit in such a small icon might be difficult to make it look good - an index finger on it's own really is quite obvious isn't it?
Hmm, I think that would be a lot less describing than just having the keyboard. There is nothing really typing-specific about an index finger and looks more like someone is pointing than typing. I was thinking more along the lines of talking analogy rather than typing. Ie. the person is in the process of communicating with you.
How about a speech bubble with a "..." in?
Created attachment 83162 [details] lighter group-chat icon How about this lighter version of the group chat icon?
Created attachment 87464 [details] summary of what we have Ok so here is a summary of what we have so far, I hope I didn't forget something. Is it possible to have all those icons in 16x16 and 22x22 and scallable? I guess the svg is the same for all png sizes so it's just a matter of rendering png... What is still needed ? Btw, why does gossip uses stock icons for status,etc? Why not using named icons?
Note that there are still unresolved issues from above with several of the icons. It might be better to try and fix those first. > Btw, why does gossip uses stock icons for status,etc? Why not using named > icons? Because the icon theme API didn't exist back when gossip was started and there hasn't been much of a reason to change that code.
Hm, I went ahead and commited icons for: available away busy extended-away group-message message offline typing We need to go through this bug and sort out what bits are still unresolved and preferably create new bugs for those (one per icon).
Gossip development has been stalled and it has been unmaintained for a few years now. You may use 'empathy' for similar functionality. Maintainers don't have future development plan so i am closing bugs as WONTFIX. Please feel free to reopen the bugs in future if anyone takes the responsibility for active development.