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Bug 101844 - Saving an original JPEG creates a smaller image
Saving an original JPEG creates a smaller image
Status: VERIFIED DUPLICATE of bug 75398
Product: GIMP
Classification: Other
Component: User Interface
1.x
Other Windows
: Normal normal
: ---
Assigned To: GIMP Bugs
Daniel Egger
Depends on:
Blocks:
 
 
Reported: 2002-12-23 09:32 UTC by Sicco Ens
Modified: 2009-08-15 18:40 UTC
See Also:
GNOME target: ---
GNOME version: ---



Description Sicco Ens 2002-12-23 09:32:48 UTC
I had some pictures (of Moths) of about 1.500 kB. I changed them a little 
and than saved them. The sizes were decreased by about 1.000 kB or more. 
I tried this again on smaller pics and these were also considerably 
increased (from 66 kB to 17, 87 kB to 24). This only happened the first 
time I saved them after a 'save as' e.g. to create a file comment. Later 
saving kept the image-size as it was before, but nevertheless about half 
the size of the original. I think that I can work around this problem by 
using 'save as' any time that I want to save the file but 1. that is not 
very convenient and 2. when I use 'save' by mistake, my file is shrunk 
automatically.
Comment 1 Dave Neary 2002-12-23 14:00:12 UTC
This is because the JPEG plug-in currently can't read the save quality
at load time for jpeg images. The workaround is to save at a very high
quality when you're saving the image the first time. This is related
to another (fixed) bug which concerns plug-ins setting default values
- in cases where eth save values cannot be read from the image, they
shouldn't be guessed.

In brief, you are saving your jpegs at a lower quality than the
original, this is why they are smalelr. To have your saved images
about the same size, you should increase the save quality to 90 or 95%.

Given that the bug report mentions that this happens during a "Save
As", and not just during a "Save", I think we can close this bug as
NOTABUG.

Cheers,
Dave.
Comment 2 Dave Neary 2002-12-23 16:36:42 UTC
Received a mail from the original submitter informing me that I
misunderstood his report, and that he didn't know how to attach the
comment on bugzilla. I will attach his mail when I can, in the
meantilme I'm changing trhe status to reopened.

Dave.
Comment 3 Dave Neary 2002-12-25 10:36:49 UTC
Sorry - technical difficulties meant that I didn't have the mail until
now - attaching it here.

Hello Dave,

Thanks for your prompt reply on my problem, on which I however still
have a problem.

I do not know how to change my comment, therefor I try your e-mail in
hope that you can tell me the proper way.

My problem/comment:
This only happened the first time I saved them after a 'save as' e.g.
to create a file comment.

Your comment: "Given that the bug report mentions that this happens
during a "Save As", and not just during a "Save", I think we can close
this bug as NOTABUG".

No, I do not agree. It is just the contraire, I think I was not clear
enough so you misunderstood.

I first used 'save as' to add a comment, during this save as I
increased the quality to about 95% (and pressed the button
'optimize'). Then, after I changed something, and I said ->
right-click, ->file, ->save then my picture is shrunk. That is why I
wrote: "I think that I can work around this problem by using 'save as'
any time that I want to save the file but 1. that is not very
convenient and 2. when I use 'save' by mistake, my file is shrunk
automatically." because then I can adjust the quality of the picture
and not by just using 'save'!

I hope that I made clear what I mean, because for me, as a Dutchman,
it is not easy to explain such a problem of a bit theoretically type
in the technically right way.

Kind regards,

Sicco

Comment 4 Dave Neary 2002-12-25 10:43:36 UTC
For what it's worth, I can't reproduce this. the jpeg-save-vals
parasite gets correctly created and attached to the image at a Save
As, and during saves afterwards, the resulting images are more or less
the same size as the size after the Save As.

Cheers,
Dave.
Comment 5 Sven Neumann 2003-01-01 15:40:10 UTC
I think this is a duplicate of bug #75398.
Comment 6 Dave Neary 2003-01-01 21:11:35 UTC
I thought so at first too. However, the original author says that this
occurs after a "Save as" where he sets quality settings to his
preferred level. During a Save as in the jpeg plug-in the
jpeg-save-vals parasite is attached to the image, and all future saves
of that image should use those correctly. The original author reports
that those values aren't respected when he saves. 

As I read it, it's a different issue. But I'll repeat, it's not an
issue I've been able to resolve. Perhaps Sicco could add some further
information?

Cheers,
Dave.
Comment 7 Sicco Ens 2003-01-02 11:21:07 UTC
After reading bug #75398 carefully, I must admit that it seems to 
have a lot in common with my problem, although I do not completely 
understand the statements about plug-ins and parasites (my knowledge 
of this, for me rather technicall English is just not enough).
I try to give a better description of my problem in order to give you 
the opportunity to decide if this is a duplicate or not.
1. I scan a foto or diapositive, at a choosen quality.
2. I work on that foto and use 'Save as' in order to add a comment.
   during this 'Save as' I adjust the quality from 75% to a value
   between 90 and 100%. The result is a file that has about the same
   size or is even (much) bigger than the original.
3. After reopening this foto and some changing I pressed 'Save' or
   'ctr-s', the result is a considerable smaller file with less 
   quality, which I do not want.
4. After reopening this smaller foto adjusting it and then saving it
   again with 'Save', the quality is about the same as before this
   action. 

Hope this helps to decide whether this is a duplicate or not, my 
suggestion however is that, when I read it over, it is.

Sicco
  
 
Comment 8 Sven Neumann 2003-01-02 13:09:31 UTC
The GIMP cannot determine the settings you used to save a JPEG when
you open it. This is a problem with the JPEG file format since the
information is simply not stored in the image file. Thus, when you are
opening a JPEG file and later save it, you need to determine the
quality settings. Due to bug #75398, the JPEG plug-in used to use
default settings instead of asking the user. Your report is thus a
duplicate of #75398.

The main problem here is however that your work-flow is flawed. You
should never save an image using the lossy JPEG format unless you are
distributing a final version of it. Even then you should keep a copy
in a lossless format. Otherwise you will loose quality every time you
edit the image and fter a couple of open-save iterations the artefacts
introduced by the JPEG compression algorithm become visible. 

*** This bug has been marked as a duplicate of 75398 ***
Comment 9 Raphaël Quinet 2003-06-20 16:44:41 UTC
The fix is part of the stable release 1.2.4.  Closing this bug.