GNOME Bugzilla – Bug 787493
New Account Type - Unit Trust
Last modified: 2018-06-29 23:59:24 UTC
Hi, I am a new user of Gnucash 2.6.17 on a Mac and after many years using the earlier versions (95/98) of Quicken on Windows Have started a fresh set of accounts on Gnucash, for personal use, since the 1st Sept. I have managed to operate my way through how different the app works, and am actually enjoying the learning experience. In the years previous to this I have invested funds in several unit trusts, or what I believe some call, Mutual Funds. I would like to add the current balances of the unit trusts as opening balances in Gnucash however despite reading the online manual and doing some Google searching as well as Buzilla searching, have been unable to sucessfully create a unit trust type of account hierachy, as the account type is not specified. Further delving into the app trying to use either 'Stock' or 'Mutual fund' did not assist as then I needed to select the 'Security/Currency'. When I clicked on Select it only showed non-currency related items, and none of them in south Africa. As my country currency is not listed, despite being listed if I choose to add an 'Asset' account. The composition of the units purchased is decided by the parent company from which you are buying the unit trusts. The money given to the company for the purchase of your units is invested in a variety of assets that should provide a return ie gold bullion, stocks purchased in a particular range of companies, bonds etc. As the value of those investments increases ie those companies invested in are now worth more, so the value of a unit trust unit increases. The parent company has absolute discretion on where and when it wants to invest your money and so amanages the risk and ensures a positive return on investment, allowing them to take a fee of the profit earned. A unit trust will normally be traded in the home country currency but may be traded in a completely different currency ie whilst the home currrency is ZAR, I may have a unit trust that is traded in GBP. A unit trust consists of units purchased, usually to 2 or 3 decimal points ie 0.01 or 0.001 but some might be more, a price per full unit and then the currency value of the total units held in that particular named unit trust. I believe this unit trust account type needs adding to the type of accounts that can be selected.
You account for your investment in units of the unit trust, not in currency. That's why Accounts of type STOCK and FUND take a non-currency commodity, which you must create. Please study the Tutorial and Concepts Guide, particularly Chapter 9, Investments (http://www.gnucash.org/docs/v2.6/C/gnucash-guide/chapter_invest.html) and Chapter 11, Capital Gains (http://www.gnucash.org/docs/v2.6/C/gnucash-guide/chapter_invest.html) for an explanation of how to account for non-currency assets. If you have further questions you may subscribe the the gnucash-user mailing list (https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user) and ask there.
Dear John, You are incorrect. You account for your investment in units, expressed as having a currency value. Each transaction is actually measured in currency as there is a price per unit which must be paid or received. I tried to enter the investment as a mutual fund but the price calculation would not allow me to enter in values to 4 decimal places. After changing decimal places in the settings, I saw no change. Despite your advice and your inability to understand my mention that I had read and STUDIED the documentation and tried Google searches, I tried many methods to get the unit trust accounts to display properly, Gnucash is just not currently suitable for unit trust accounts, in my opinion, even if the account is marked as a Mutual fund or Stock, of which it is neither. If there is anyone else who actually uses Gnucash for South African unit trusts, I would be most pleased to hear from you. Again John, thank you for taking it upon yourself to close my bugzilla post before doing any investigation into the mattter or even waiting for a reply from the original poster. So much for you using the community user platform to improve the product. Let's make Gnucash great again.
Perhaps a course in basic accounting will help you to learn. Regardless, the bug tracker is not the place for support questions. You're already subscribed to the user list, please continue the discussion there.
(In reply to Hylton from comment #0) > Further delving into the app trying to use either 'Stock' or 'Mutual fund' > did not assist as then I needed to select the 'Security/Currency'. When I > clicked on Select it only showed non-currency related items, and none of > them in south Africa. As my country currency is not listed, despite being > listed if I choose to add an 'Asset' account. Just ignore this stupid US templates and overwrite them with something more useful for you. I group my investments by bonds shares funds options ... appending e.g. ":GBP" for commodities noted in foreign currencies.
John, whilst I respect your contribution i.t.o. development of GnuCash, I feel you certainly need to take a refresher course in customer service. For your information, I am well versed in accounting having completed the subject top of my class at high school and consequently also completed 1st yr university accounting where I am fully aware that Assets-Liabilities=Owners Equity yet Gnucash does not seem to follow GAAP(Generally Accepted Accounting Practice) rules. Personal attack noted and put aside as it does nothing to help the GnuCash product. Unfortunately we both made assumptions and all it did was make an ASS of U + ME. > Again, I don't see the difference. In my example above, if I bought 10 shares, I would have a transaction for $50, I would own 10 such shares, that wouldbe worth $50. My issue is related to the fact that I cannot create the account opening balances as at 31/08 from my paper statement which shows both the price, the number of units held and the closing market ZAR value of the units held in that particular unit trust asset. Using either a Mutual fund or Stock, did not allow me to correctly show the opening ZAR value of my unit trusts. When I open a new account as a mutual fund, it mistakenly marks the ZAR value of this asset as negative. According to John a course in basic accounting would fix this, however nowhere have I ever seen an asset marked as a negative currency value. Should I try and open a new account as a stock, the tab on the new account windows indicating Opening Balance' is greyed out, just as it is on a Mutual Fund? I basically need to add a Current Asset called Unit Trusts which totals the ZAR value of its sub accounts, of which there will be five named AG-Bal, AG-E, AG-MM, AG-O, Cor-Balp each with an opening balance on the 31/08/2017 consisting of number of units to 4 decimal places, a unit price in cents to 2 decimal places/(ZAR to 4 decimal places) and a closing market value, in ZAR to 2 decimal places, which depending on the fund may/may not be the product of units x price i.e. the closing market value. THIS IS THE CRUNCH: THE OPENING BALANCE ZAR VALUE OR THE CLOSING MARKET VALUE ON THE PREVIOUS DAY MAY/MAY NOT BE THE PRODUCT OF UNITS OWNED X PRICE A single account on my paper statement shows: Units: 6659.22 Unit Price(cents): 2245.70 Closing Market Value: ZAR 149546.01 I am hopeful, once I can get the Opening Balances completed, that I will then be able to figure out how transaction will be entered correctly so at least my assets don't show up as a negative. Thankfully transactions seemingly follow the unit x price in ZAR cents = ZAR value added/withdrawn from fund. I hope the example above helps illustrate how a unit trust opening value needs to be entered so as to correctly indicate the positive ZAR value of the asset to the account holder.
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